smallTalk 2025

Talk#4 with Patrick

Expanding on Connection. From experience in the taiji tuishou we see the level of the mind primarily determines the quality of the connection. Connection can form on every level. If you reach out from the superficial mind, the connection will be superficial. Then there is also the motive. Within each level there is a range of qualities according to the motive.

On the Physical-Etheric level I teach don’t blindly reach out to other Beings on that level. The problem is many low quality Beings are based on that level. If your teacher themselves based on at least the Deep Mental, uses it as a method of training then under their close supervision it can be ok, but it is still not really recommended.

I began to train that decades ago but my Inner Guide warned me against it and Abdullah later confirmed that. Abdullah said he could teach someone to see into the Etheric world within a few months as it doesn’t require any particular degree of internal growth.

It appears that in my previous life I trained that within the Daoist tradition. If you have done it before it is more likely to come quickly – so its more dangerous. If your aim is the Celestial, Deep Mental, then you shouldn’t get involved in the Physical-Etheric to any extent or it is likely to waylay you in that life.

We do train connection on the Physical-Etheric level in the tuishou, with someone we know and trust. Also when in the meditation we sit quietly together, there is some intermingling of the Etheric fields, but that’s quite ok.

Some ask about healing practices where you connect to the Physical-Etheric being of another person. It is generally ok because you are usually not creating a long-lasting connection with that person. But there are possibilities of trouble if you interact in that way with a person already compromised by the Jinn.

So when I say don’t connect into the Physical-Etheric world, I’m not talking about with physical people who you know or choose. But if you start to connect into the wider Etheric world through meditation or other exercises, you almost certainly will attract the attention of ill-intentioned beings within the Etheric. They will take notice of you and attempt to connect with you. They can read you thoughts, feelings or energy. They know information about the past and to some extent the future, though only on the Physical-Etheric level and perhaps a little into the Deep Emotional. They will offer you that knowledge and power to build your trust, then gradually lead you astray.

It is largely danger from the Jinn in the Etheric realm, but there are also Shaman type people who specifically train to gain knowledge, power and influence on that level. There is not much difference between negative Jinn and negative Humans, they will both seek to weaken then break your connection to your Higher Self and Inner Guide.

When you come to the Deep Emotional realm then to connect with other people near or far is the natural operation of the Deep Emotions. They are mostly receptive, becoming active in response to others. While you can generate a new intention leading to action from your self, emotions are usually generated as a response to incoming thoughts, feelings or actions from another being.

Sending out light, or light and love if you choose to think of it in that way, is an essential part of the development of the Deep Emotions. We can’t say there is no danger in doing this but the danger is quite small and of a different nature than the dangers of connecting within the Physical-Etheric realm.

To look a little closer, the lower section of the Deep Emotional is in contact with the Physical-Etheric world and constantly overreacting to the impulses from that outer level. The main training is to learn not to over-react, which means don’t add an extra response from the Deep Emotional to the almost inevitably already appearing Physical-Etheric reaction.

Interactions with people and beings within the Deep Emotional realm become realistically possible only when the Deep Emotional is no longer overreacting to the lower impulses. At that stage the Deep Emotional also becomes more free to begin their interaction with beings on the Deep Mental level.

The Deep Emotional realm is much larger and more complex than the Physical-Etheric realm. The Deep Mental realm is that much larger and more complex again. The beings on the Deep Mental you will initially meet are your Inner Guide, the Deep Mental aspect of your physical teacher – assuming they have some development on that level which would normally mean past the 3rd Initiation. You can meet the beings that stand behind your teacher. You can’t really function as a ‘spiritual teacher’ until you are past the 3rd. Before that you are more like a senior instructor for your own teacher.

Each line of teachers has a head on a high level who looks after that lineage. But you don’t necessarily know who that is. For example Li Po while he was alive was looking after the Daoist and Buddhist line on the Earth, while the Buddha looks after that line on a much higher level again. On that higher level Rumi has been looking after the Sufis. Abraham was looking after the Abrahamic teachings – Jewish, Christian, Muslim.

So you have the Guide, your teacher, your teacher’s teachers and then others beyond that who you most likely won’t know of exactly but you can be certain they exist. Sometimes there may also be a connection with teachers on a teaching line from previous recent lives.

Beyond that there are 2 major Beings – the Being who maintains our Solar System and the Being who maintains our Earthly System – that might be considered to include the Moon. These are 2 very High Beings far beyond my personal understanding.

These 2 High Beings do exist. Our Physical-Etheric system is given to you from the Being of the Earth when you come into a body, and you give it back some time after physical death – how long after depends on our inner state. In that process you either dissolve back into the Earth’s Physical-Etheric being or you leave your Physical-Etheric body behind to that fate and withdraw to the higher levels.

The Being of the Sun is the source of our Self. The Being of the Sun is much more than the radiating gaseous inferno. If you took away the Sun right now, almost everything in the Solar System would die very quickly. But if you took away the Earths energy field now, we would also be destroyed very quickly by the tremendous radiation of the Solar Being which normal humanity is not at a level to withstand. In this sense you can understand the situation quite realistically as the Earth protects us as our mother, from the tremendous energy field of our father the Solar Being.

The 7 levels through which humans can rise within the Solar System comprise the Physical-Etheric realm from the point of view of the Solar Being on a higher turn of the spiral. The first 3 levels (Physical-Etheric, Deep Emotional, Deep Mental) are the Solar Physical and the 4 above that are the Solar Etheric. The lower 3 levels can’t survive in the intense atmosphere of the Sun but the higher 4 levels can. When you pass the 3rd-Initiation you can move and survive closer to the Sun after death. Past the 4th you can withdraw completely to the Sun after death.

It is possible to connect to the Solar Being and the Earthly Being. I’m speaking from what I know personally. We can connect to these 2 to because we already are connected in a tenuous manner. Our Physical-Etheric is from the Earth and our Higher Self is from the Sun. The Earth can appear to a person, typically as an animal. The Sun can do similarly, typically as something like an Angel, not with wings, but as an intense, intelligent field of light.

You might ask then are we a part of those beings or independent from them? The relationship is the same as a child to a parent. You begin as almost fully a part of the parents and later grow to full independence, ultimately equivalent to the parents from who you began. That’s the exact relationship you have to the Earth and Sun – fully corresponding to the relationship of a child to the parents.

The child’s body is formed from the germ cells created by their grandparents bodies. The 4 grandparents give you your Hereditary Essence. That’s modified by your parents up to the moment when you are conceived. We grow into a dependent being inside the mother, born as a barely independent being, grow to 7 years as a partially independent being (the mothers etheric field supports it for the first 7 years), becomes a semi independent being at 14 and fully independent at 21, more or less.

If you know the general method of building a connection, then you know the essence of how to build a relationship through that connection. A relatively unconscious connection can become more conscious and enhanced by your reaching out towards the source of that connection. At the same time as developing on one level you also need to aspire to connect to the level above. Otherwise you will continue on your present level. Associated with that is to gradually remove attachments to the connections previously formed on a lower level. To separate from the Physical-Etheric which will somewhat naturally take place as the Deep Emotional self grows stronger, the Physical-Etheric is not really diminished, it continues as it was but your view of the self changes.

After the 2nd Initiation, as you move the sense of yourself further into the Deep Emotional realm and further away from the Physical-Etheric realm, you can look back and see your past associations as not exactly any longer who you are, although all outer connections may in fact remained unchanged externally. You separate yourself by the Deep Emotional sense of self becoming so strong and real that the lower connections seem quite distant when you look back down on them.

Similarly when approaching the Deep Mental the sense of yourself on that new level grows so strong that on looking back down at the Deep Emotional it no longer really feels like who you are, but just a level through which you function when needed.

Nothing changes on those lower levels but your inner sense of them does change. If you are still afraid of dying then your main attachment is still to the body. After you die and are in the Etheric realm all people look back down at their dead body and don’t in any way feel that is them. The Etheric body with the sense of self now attached to that, continues to exist almost unchanged while in that state. When you then withdraw further back into the Deep Emotional and the Etheric Body is left behind to fade away, you don’t in any sense feel that that was you, once the sense of self attaches itself the Deep Emotional body, which is relatively unchanged by the death on the lower levels.

The Physical-Etheric body is different from the Deep Emotional body and above, as it has been already prepared by the Earth due to the millions of years of evolution. But the higher bodies are not prepared as the general level of humanity is not at that stage. The Physical-Etheric Soul is given to us partially developed but the ones above much less so. You feel strongly you are Italian or French or British, Asian or African, male or female, but all this is given to you and will change completely from life to life. It is not something you have developed yourself over lifetimes. It is much less you than the bodies on the levels above which we develop individually and carry with us from life to life.

Q&A

Q: Could you tell us something about the Moon?
P: I have read and heard many things but I really know very little from myself. I presume it also is informed by an Intelligent Being but it remains an enigma in my understanding.

Q: What do you know about Jupiter?
P: If the sun disappeared, only Jupiter would survive as it radiates more energy than it absorbs. In this sense it can be considered a second sun. Most solar systems have two suns. Jupiter is massively larger than all the other planets. To the best of my knowledge each planet has a Being whose body is formed by that planet. Clearly the Being associated with Jupiter is more evolved than the other planets.

Q: Do the teaching lines ultimately lead back to the Earth and Sun?
P: The evolution of humanity is looked after by the Earth and the Sun. The Earth looks after the general evolution of all living things. The spiritual teaching lines connected with humanity lead back to the Sun.

Q: Given that your hereditary is connected to your grandparents, how does that effect IVF babies and surrogate mothers?
P: The Hereditary Essence is set according to the germ cells formed in the original grandparents. It then becomes a little more complex as the parents who raise the child contribute something different, but it is not bad in any sense that I know of.

Q: I find it difficult to really know what the Deep Emotional world is?
P: You experience the Deep Emotional in reference to those who are closely connected to you, or with Beings above who you are connected with. If something comes down from the Deep Mental then it will be quite clear that is a highly positive emotion. But if there is an event say with you parents when they get a little angry and discipline you, then it will be a mixture of Deep Emotional and normal emotions so difficult to separate.

When there is no external negativity associated with the event that concerns those with whom you are closely connected, then it will be a relatively pure Deep Emotional event. An example is the birth of a child – very strong, but fully positive, not at all negative. Also the death of an older parent who might have lived a good live – another strong event but not necessarily negative because your Deep Emotional knows that death of the body is not death of the person.

Q: You mentioned connection to the levels you are leaving behind changes – what do you mean?
P: It happens naturally as you strengthen the sense of self on, say, the Deep Emotional level. The centre of your being gradually moves away from the Physical-Etheric level and establishes itself on the Deep Emotional. Then from that new elevated place, you look back on something that doesn’t hold you quite as strongly as it did before.

Q: When sending light to someone and they die will it still reach them and where?
P: When you send out light to connect into the Deep Emotional world or attempt to connect into the Deep Mental (which you can try because we already have a small presence on those levels) that is not dependent on the receiving person being in a body

But once out of the body 2 different possibilities arise. The person to who you are sending the light may remain in the Etheric while their Etheric Body and its attached consciousness gradually fades over about 21 years, or they may leave the Etheric after 3 to 7 days and withdraw to the Deep Emotional where they will then realise that is the real them and they were never in fact the Physical-Etheric.

If they remain in the Etheric they will fully receive the light you are sending them and after 7 years or less of a daily dose they will reconnect to their Spirit and withdraw to the Deep Emotional realm, soon after to be born again in another body.

Q: Do the physical desires hold us to the body? Do we need to become non-attached to these?
P: The idea of non-attachment is not the best explanation of what takes place. It is better to understand the sense of self changes and moves towards the next level, from where you look back with a naturally somewhat disconnected view.

Q: Do we need to know the heads of the traditions?
P: The heads of the lineages that I know are all past the 6th Initiation. Those in a body seldom know of them. Someone past the 4th could find out any of these things if they had a reason to do so.

Q: How would we find out about lineages which we have been connected with in past lives?
P: When you needed to know you would be lead to discover it, but almost always the information from past lives is not relevant until past the 3rd Initiation and even than only particularly relevant lives would be presented to you. The essence of all past lives is with us in this present life.

Q: How do we understand that the emotions should be passive?
P: Receptive explains it better than passive. Gurdjieff said you can work on the moving centre by yourself but you need other people to work on the emotional centre, because it activates in response to what comes in from people with whom you are closely connected. When the emotions are not passive, in the sense of receptive, it is usually because they are over-reacting to difficult external events.

Q: How far back do humans go in connection with the Solar Being?
P: At least 40,000 years, though the ape-like bodies needed 10 times that amount to reach a point where human Spirits could enliven them. Our present civilisation extends back over the past 8000 years. There was certainly a chain of previous civilisations for 10s of 1000s of years before that. The previous one was wiped out by an ice age or mini ice around 12,000 years ago.

There was teacher arose 8000 years ago who passed the 6th Initiation while in a body, something that has never been done since. Zoroaster is now close to the 7th which will mean a fully grown independent child of our Solar Being, ready to leave the Solar System for higher realms. All esoteric teachings presently on the Earth came forth from him. Those teachings developed in 3 lines, spreading into the Nile Valley, the Indus Valley and the Yellow River Valley.